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PAS fluid Headache conundrum


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36 replies to this topic

#21 hardy1812

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 01:02 PM

attachicon.gifF2CFAC91-09F1-4032-9E10-879B68289291.png

This is the one I put in mine, it’s red and mines a 54plate bought 3 ltrs flushed 2 through,, I just used a hand wash pump thing to empty the bottle, disconnected the bottom hose and put it in an empty 5 litre tub (screen wash tub) topped up the bottle and had me dad start the car whilst I poured in the new stuff,, then when 2 flush through reconnected the bottom hose and filled up bottle and just turned the steering wheel from lock to lock without starting the car,, then I started the car and topped up to max mark. Oh I purchased mine in February 2020 and I’ve had no leaks or squeals up to now,,, famous last words hahaha

Thanks for the info and good description of how you changed yours, I will set about changing mine later in week when i have all the bits together to complete.
Should have added that I put bung over the bottom outlet on the bottle,, piece of rubber glove and an elastic band just to stop the fluid coming out the pot where the pipe was hahaha.

#22 nicam49

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 02:11 PM

To bung that spout, I got a tip from this forum, which was to use a 3" piece of garden hose with a suitably-sized bolt screwed into one end...fits the spout a treat.
<p><p>nicam49 2002 Mondeo TDCi Ghia X Estate mk3 pre facelift Stardust Silver+Rust.[b] 308,000+miles, but been off the road since Nov 2019 after timing chain slipped during fuel pump transplant. Awaiting return of mojo

#23 raynkar

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 04:28 PM

 

 

 

 

Lubricants, Fluids, Sealers and Adhesives

 

*Hydraulic Fluid - All except vehicles with Electro-Hydraulic Power Steering (EHPS) WSA-M2C195-A

 

*Hydraulic Fluid - All vehicles WSS-M2C204-A2

 

* Hydraulic Fluid with the specification WSS-M2C204-A2 can also be used to top up or fill steering systems that are filled with Hydraulic Fluid with the specification WSA-M2C195-A.

 

 

Just found this info on the Ford workshop owners manual website, even though its for a 2004 Focus, it shows that the fluids are interchangeable as long as you don't have an electro system, which does need 204 spec fluid.

I think that fords wanted a single fluid for all vehicles of a certain age so changed to 204 even though the 195 spec should work fine, hence why only the ford manual  says to use the 204 spec fluid.

 

link

Ford Workshop Manuals > Focus 2004.75 (07.2004-) > Mechanical Repairs > 2 Chassis > 211 Steering System > 211-00 Steering System - General Information > Specifications (workshop-manuals.com)

 

The same site shows the mondy 2000-2007  using the wss-m2c-195-a spec fluid

 

link

Ford Workshop Manuals > Mondeo 2001 (10.2000-02.2007) > Mechanical Repairs > 2 Chassis > 211 Steering System > 211-00 Steering System - General Information > Specifications (workshop-manuals.com)

 

Has anybody got a Haynes manual for the 2003-2007 Mondeo and take a look in it for me as to what fluid they recommend, as i really dont want to pay £18 just for a quick look at specs

 

 

 

The facelift car takes, and the Haynes manual state the fluid I posted a pic of earlier in the thread.

Perhaps your ‘conundrum’ is that a couple of posters who have already researched the correct fluid have told you what it is, and yet you are still asking :) :).

 

I agree with you, the handbook from ford for my car states that the fluid you showed a pic of is the correct fluid, but i do not believe that is the fluid that has been in my car for the last 5 years+ and the fact that many other car fluid sellers sites when putting in my car details returns a different spec fluid.

That is why i continued my research to learn more about the different fluid types there application uses and viscosity levels etc.

Which is why i now believe that both fluid type are fine to use in the power steering system unless you have a newer electro spec option.

 

 

While both specs of fluid can be put into the system it’s a bit like being able to put DOT 3 brake fluid in just because you can :)

The specs changed as capabilities improved, so it makes sense to put the best possible fluid in the system.

Trying to stick with the exact same fluid that has been in for some time is a non starter.................as brand new fluids don’t come with water and rubber particles in the bottle ;)

 

At least your research so far has shown that other fluid selling sites aren’t to be trusted. The same will apply for ebay, Halfords, Euro car parts and GSF car parts etc. These are littered with inaccurate parts fitments or age range specifications. :)


You can put your vehicle info at the bottom of your posts to give details to help others know what you drive :)

#24 PURPLE_2L_LX

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 05:51 PM

2003 - 2007 Haynes manual states 204


MK4.5 TDCI 140 Business Estate.

 

MK3 FUSE INFO CLICK HERE ... FORD WIKI CLICK HERE .... FORD ETIS CLICK HERE

Adding your location may find someone local who could offer assistance.

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#25 Huckster522

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 09:46 PM

So 204 spec it is then ?

Genuine Ford Power Steering Fluid 1ltr WSS-M2C204-A2, 1781003

Email this supplier for confirmation

https://www.ebay.co....sQAAOSw-JJacfYX

Probably not but Just as well that supplier has stock, looks like its the only place who has other than Fraud Stealers who will definitely charge premium dollars a bottle



#26 Huckster522

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 09:55 PM

 

 

 

 

 

Lubricants, Fluids, Sealers and Adhesives

 

*Hydraulic Fluid - All except vehicles with Electro-Hydraulic Power Steering (EHPS) WSA-M2C195-A

 

*Hydraulic Fluid - All vehicles WSS-M2C204-A2

 

* Hydraulic Fluid with the specification WSS-M2C204-A2 can also be used to top up or fill steering systems that are filled with Hydraulic Fluid with the specification WSA-M2C195-A.

 

 

Just found this info on the Ford workshop owners manual website, even though its for a 2004 Focus, it shows that the fluids are interchangeable as long as you don't have an electro system, which does need 204 spec fluid.

I think that fords wanted a single fluid for all vehicles of a certain age so changed to 204 even though the 195 spec should work fine, hence why only the ford manual  says to use the 204 spec fluid.

 

link

Ford Workshop Manuals > Focus 2004.75 (07.2004-) > Mechanical Repairs > 2 Chassis > 211 Steering System > 211-00 Steering System - General Information > Specifications (workshop-manuals.com)

 

The same site shows the mondy 2000-2007  using the wss-m2c-195-a spec fluid

 

link

Ford Workshop Manuals > Mondeo 2001 (10.2000-02.2007) > Mechanical Repairs > 2 Chassis > 211 Steering System > 211-00 Steering System - General Information > Specifications (workshop-manuals.com)

 

Has anybody got a Haynes manual for the 2003-2007 Mondeo and take a look in it for me as to what fluid they recommend, as i really dont want to pay £18 just for a quick look at specs

 

 

 

The facelift car takes, and the Haynes manual state the fluid I posted a pic of earlier in the thread.

Perhaps your ‘conundrum’ is that a couple of posters who have already researched the correct fluid have told you what it is, and yet you are still asking :) :).

 

I agree with you, the handbook from ford for my car states that the fluid you showed a pic of is the correct fluid, but i do not believe that is the fluid that has been in my car for the last 5 years+ and the fact that many other car fluid sellers sites when putting in my car details returns a different spec fluid.

That is why i continued my research to learn more about the different fluid types there application uses and viscosity levels etc.

Which is why i now believe that both fluid type are fine to use in the power steering system unless you have a newer electro spec option.

 

 

While both specs of fluid can be put into the system it’s a bit like being able to put DOT 3 brake fluid in just because you can :)

The specs changed as capabilities improved, so it makes sense to put the best possible fluid in the system.

Trying to stick with the exact same fluid that has been in for some time is a non starter.................as brand new fluids don’t come with water and rubber particles in the bottle ;)

 

At least your research so far has shown that other fluid selling sites aren’t to be trusted. The same will apply for ebay, Halfords, Euro car parts and GSF car parts etc. These are littered with inaccurate parts fitments or age range specifications. :)

 

Yes your right all searches for the correct spec fluids, both 204 and 195 returns so many products that will not perform anywhere near the specs that ford recommends.

 

The 204 spec is the better product to use as the viscosity is thinner than the 195 which would make the steering feel lighter and also maintains better viscosity at working temperatures, also the fluid will cool more efficiently on its return to the reservoir.

 

But as it states quite clearly in the Ford manual its only the "recommended fluid" as it performs slightly better than the other fluids they used to recommend.



#27 raynkar

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 11:07 PM

Huckster.

 

The idea of mk3 steering feeling lighter made me smile. :)

Every time I get in mine now (a rare thing) the steering feels so heavy it feels like there is no power steering. The same applies to the brakes, and feels like there is no servo in operation :)


You can put your vehicle info at the bottom of your posts to give details to help others know what you drive :)

#28 PURPLE_2L_LX

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Posted 18 January 2021 - 05:22 AM

The brakes on the MK3 are terrible. When test driving the MK4 there was a

ramp going down towards the road and I braked as I would with the MK3...

 

Almost had to peel my nose off the windscreen.  MK4 brakes are way better.

 

Wonder if thats an upgrade option rather than use the Focus ST brakes?

 

MK3 brakes on the ST220 must be fun... Is willing it to stop or prayer the

best option?


MK4.5 TDCI 140 Business Estate.

 

MK3 FUSE INFO CLICK HERE ... FORD WIKI CLICK HERE .... FORD ETIS CLICK HERE

Adding your location may find someone local who could offer assistance.

F-Super, Bluetooth OBDII (ELM) and a MS509 scanners (test subjects required).

ForDiag now available to victims.


#29 Communist

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Posted 18 January 2021 - 10:33 AM

The reason mk3 brakes don't feel so sharp as newer cars is because of the servo. Jaguar X types have the same calipers and brake system otherwise, but a different servo, and they feel more assisted and progressive. Maybe they used another master as well, but the servo certainly isn't the same.

 

Pads make a difference too. My brake feel was non existant for years. A tiny bit of travel and then they were rock hard and you just pushed against that. Then the cheapo front pads started making noise, so I replaced them with a set of brembo pads and got an enormous boost in brake feel I wasn't at all expecting. Still not as good as most are, but far better. I've still got crap ones on the rear, but I doubt changing them will make much of a difference seeing as most of the braking is at the front.

 

As for power steering, mines got the original fluid in it, and it's also red. Never seen green PAS fluid before. I love the weighting of the mk3 steering. It's not too heavy it's unreasonable, it's light enough that it isn't a chore, but still offers good feel. It's better than the steering in the BMWs of the time. They also got the speed sensitivity of it correct, in that you'd never even notice that it has it, unlike say, some of the vauxhalls where the weighting can change mid corner...

 

That said, the steering I'm used to in the Mk3 is the rack you get in the 4cyl petrol, which is different to the diesel & V6 rack. I've driven a diesel once, from what I remember it's a bit quicker but had a touch less feel to me. X types have another rack entirely. If you really wanted lighter steering you could try one of those.


Edited by Communist, 18 January 2021 - 10:36 AM.


#30 raynkar

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Posted 18 January 2021 - 03:51 PM

The brakes on the MK3 are terrible. When test driving the MK4 there was a

ramp going down towards the road and I braked as I would with the MK3...

 

Almost had to peel my nose off the windscreen.  MK4 brakes are way better.

 

Wonder if thats an upgrade option rather than use the Focus ST brakes?

 

MK3 brakes on the ST220 must be fun... Is willing it to stop or prayer the

best option?

 

As stated above, the servo is mostly the issue with the mk3, not the pads or calipers.

But, even though all mk3 cars have the same servo, calipers and pads the 220 and non ST 3.0 have by far the worst mk3 brakes as they have engines that give a very lazy vacuum.

 

One time a garage cracked my servo to inlet vacuum pipe. As I drove away from the garage the brakes just felt a bit worse than normal. In a normal car the difference is brake performance would have been massive.

 

The first time I drove a 220 I had been used to a mk3 diesel and the 220 genuinely felt like it had no servo assistance at all.


You can put your vehicle info at the bottom of your posts to give details to help others know what you drive :)




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